Read this article about H.I.T and Mike Mentzer

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Azael,

Mike Mentzer certainly was an intelligent man. He managed to brainwash many people. But not training scientists or top coaches. They disagree with Mentzer at least in many points, usually in almost everything.

There is no top bodybuilder or top athlete who has trained like Mentzer in his later, "enlightened" days recommended.

People who have read only garbage like Muscle and Fiction magazines and then read Mentzer, may admire his intellectualism and "superior knowledge". But after reading some valid training science like Zatsiorsky, Siff & Verkhoshansky etc. they usually change their opinions and realize how surprisingly little Mentzer knew or cared of physiology. :itku:
 
MKM

I know that there are things that Mentzer have said that sound weird and a lot of scientists dont believe what he preached. However the things that Zatsiorsky & co count as the truth behind training can also be questioned.
Mentzers Heavy Duty has got pros and cons and so do all training systems. That is the real truth behind training.
you said that there are no champions that use Mentzers ideas. Well, can you name one bodybuilding champion that didnt use steroids. Have you ever thought about the possibility that it is the steroids that are the reason why they got so strong and big. Torbjörn Åkerfeldt said in an interview that there are bodybuilders today that use steroids that have no clue how they got so big.
I think we can end this topic now. I can agree that there is no best to train. As long as you progress you can do whatever you want. I will keep continue to use Mentzers theories since they work for me.

azael
 
Im going to do a last try to convince you that high intensity training with infrequent workouts and a small volume will work. This will be my las long article about the subject
First of all, Weight training is anaerobic, your goal shouldn’t be that you want to find out how many sets you can endure. Hit training will give you an exhilarating experience and after you have tried it there is no need to switch back to non-theoretical volume training.
Compare high intensity training with sun tanning. If you lie in the sun on a warm hot summer day when the sunrays are strong you will get a tan fast. Try to lie in the sun when the sun is covered by clouds or when the sunrays arent strong, the result will be that you wont get the tan you want. Training must be intense.
“when training is carried on beyond the reserve of resources needed for recovery growth,thus, prevents the buildup of added muscle” –Mike Mentzer
The amount of high intensity training required is very small. The workout itself is a trigger that sets the body´s growth mechanism into motion. It is the body itself that produces growth but only during a rest period that is long enough. Only when the recovery phase is over will the growth phase begin.
“If the individual stimulates the body again with another workout before it has a chance to respond with recovery and growth he short-circuits the response process before it is completed, compromissing results short of 100possible units.”-Mentzer
Those who do this are what Mentzer called “Stimulus freaks”. They over stimulate the body all the time never giving it a chance to respond to the stimulus.
You that said that it takes millions of sperms are wrong. The probability will be bigger if there is a lot of sperm and there is over 100million available if the man is a normal healthy man but it is only one sperm that fertilizes the ovum. Read some biology if you don’t believe this is true. Mentzers analogies werent always relevant but what he wanted was that people would get a new and better point of view on the great number one. He came up with this sperm analogy when Flex Wheelers training partner kept trash talking him and his clients. After this Ricco(Flex trainingpartner) never bothered Mentzer again. Analogies doesn’t prove anything , scientific studies does. Im not going to copy a whole article or study that will convince you that Menters ideas were no joke. You can find out more by yourself if you want to. You should know by now which sources you should use if you want to study H.I.T. Skip Jones books since there is more available information today. If you use Jones theories you will probably end up overtrained. This will happen unless you have superior recovery capacity or if you use steroids.
I think its time to end this topic now. H.I.T (Mentzers HIT) works. If you study all new information availible and then try it on yourself you will find out that it is a great way to train and it will produce results right from the beginning. Arthur Jones came up with HIT, I know that, but it was Mentzer who developed this system to new levels. The arguments against H.I.T are many but most of them can be rejected. There are lots of studies that support H.I.T and those who “trash talk” this system don’t have all information. Most of them have probably not tried to train according to Mentzers and H.I.T:s principles (NOT according to the number 3 magic that Jones preached).
Mike always kept asking those who preached volume training.These questions::
Why the contradiction? If each and every bodybuilder, being unique, requires a different training program, why advocate the same range of sets for everyone?
Why the equivocation? Whose word should we take -- and on what basis? Who is relating the truth: the advocates of 12-20 sets or the advocates of 75-100 sets? Or are they both unintentionally relating a falsehood?
Why the lack of exactitude? Will bodybuilders obtain equal results from 12 sets and 14 sets and 20 sets, or from 75 sets and 87 sets and 100 sets? Since science is an exact discipline, a proper science of bodybuilding should tell bodybuilders precisely what to do.
Why the evasion? Should all of the sets be performed with the same degree of intensity by the same individuals all of the time?
One more thing. Mentzer practiced what he preached those who say anything else don’t tell the truth. The reason why he trained more during his competive career was because Arthur Jones recommended that volume of about 3days a week 3 sets per bodypart (Jones science behind the number 3 is very interesting since it is based on principles that are very absurd). Mentzer didn’t believe that Jones could be wrong but in the end of his competive career he reduced the volume and frequency down to 2 days week and got better results. Its really sad that he retired so early. Mentzer himself believed that he could have developed further if he would have known what he knew in the end of the 90´s. He said that he was overtraining during his competition years.
When Mentzer started to train other people he recommended 3 workouts a week (again, the absurd science behind number 3). People got results with this system but it lead to overtraining in time since Mentzer didn’t understand the importance of infrequency. When Mentzer found out more about H.I.T he immidetley started to train his clients with 4-7days rest between each workout with reduced volume and the results were amazing. It was during the 90´s when he reduced the frequency and volume that people started to believe that he was crazy. Mentzer challenged everyone when it came to questions about training but nobody accepted the challenge.
Its interesting that a lot of people say that Mentzers principles sound good in theorie but that they don’t work in practice. If these people would have had the chance to talk to Mike or Ray most of them would have kept their mouths shut. I suggest that everyone don’t comment or trash talk the Mentzer brothers before they have all information available.
Lets end this thread now before it turns into a thread were we discuss which champion used HIT and which didn’t. Visit mikementzer.com
“Do what the nature requires to trigger the growth mechanism into a motion, then get the hell out of the gym, go home and rest and GROW” –Mike Mentzer

Azael
 
Azael, You really should be paying Pakkotoisto, because your writing is only a very thinly disguised marketing effort for Mikemenzer.com and products sold there...
 
Azael,

When I read posts by Mike Mentzer disciplines', somehow Waco and Jonestown push into my mind :rock: :hyper:

It is nice to read that you have got results by Heavy Duty, but for 99.9% of population there are much more productive ways to train. Mentzer's analogies are just total bullshit. Aspirin relieves headache. So I guess that you HD guys take only 1 mg of it? No, I am not recommending you to take either 10 grams. But could there anyhow exist a concept like optimal dose? 250-500 mg is just right to kill headache without negative side effects. Is one beer enough to get you drunk :kippis1:?
 
I really should give this a rest, but I have too much fun reading your endless posts :hyper:.

Azael sanoi:
Im going to do a last try to convince you that high intensity training with infrequent workouts and a small volume will work. This will be my las long article about the subject.
Like the previous one was?
Azael sanoi:
Compare high intensity training with sun tanning.
Why?
Azael sanoi:
Only when the recovery phase is over will the growth phase begin.
Could you please quote the study fron a peer-reviewed scientific journal, which states so? This is bullshit.
Azael sanoi:
Analogies doesn’t prove anything , scientific studies does. Im not going to copy a whole article or study that will convince you that Menters ideas were no joke.
Could you please copy here a peer-reviewed study published in a scientific journal, which proves Mentzer's "theories" correct? Pretty please? With sugar on top?
Azael sanoi:
I think its time to end this topic now. H.I.T (Mentzers HIT) works. If you study all new information availible and then try it on yourself you will find out that it is a great way to train and it will produce results right from the beginning.
I tried it about 10 years ago for 2 years. I was blind like you. Luckily, I saw the light and train more frequently now with much improved results.
 
Azael, have you ever heard a thing called "division into paragraphs"? :david:

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